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Asunto: »Political & economic ideologies (communism, capitalism et
can you find this number for Italy? (where do you find them?)
Italy: 8,1% in april 2011:
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/cache/ITY_PUBLIC/3-31052011-BP/EN/3-31052011-BP-EN.PDF
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/cache/ITY_PUBLIC/3-31052011-BP/EN/3-31052011-BP-EN.PDF
well.. 8.1????
unbeliavalble, there are entire region of italy with over than 25/30% of unemployment.
unbeliavalble, there are entire region of italy with over than 25/30% of unemployment.
this data is 3years old
the unemplyment rate is between 8 and 10% now, in some regions it is even about 12-14%.
the unemplyment rate is between 8 and 10% now, in some regions it is even about 12-14%.
Most recent info for Belgium (regions) is:
- Flanders (august 2011): 7,2% (7,8% in august 2010)
- Wallonia (april 2011): 13,4% (14,0% in april 2010)
- Brussels (july 2011): 20,6% (21,3% in july 2010)
- Flanders (august 2011): 7,2% (7,8% in august 2010)
- Wallonia (april 2011): 13,4% (14,0% in april 2010)
- Brussels (july 2011): 20,6% (21,3% in july 2010)
"Capitalism killed moral values"
Capitalism is not about morality, its most a effective way how to make economy effective. Its a tool, unlike communism its not forcing people to anything immoral or unjust.
Fact that employees doesnt really have any guaranties against employer, makes them to be always under pressure and afraid of losing job or reducing their salaries and they have really minimal options to defense. This is typical element of capitalism, for someone it can be good.
This is not typical element of capitalism. Its about employment law. Unlike in communism you shall freely respond on any job öffers and nobody can deny it. There are clear rules how agreement between employee and employer shall look like.
But I dont find it any good. It makes everyone to care about him or his family only. Citizens participation is decreasing.
Uhm this was problem of communism. Public sphere became hostile, people felt safe only in family. Even between friends they had fear to express themselves. It led to Hobess society, stealing, distrust and pretence became norm. The civic society and participation grows after 1989.
Capitalism is not about morality, its most a effective way how to make economy effective. Its a tool, unlike communism its not forcing people to anything immoral or unjust.
Fact that employees doesnt really have any guaranties against employer, makes them to be always under pressure and afraid of losing job or reducing their salaries and they have really minimal options to defense. This is typical element of capitalism, for someone it can be good.
This is not typical element of capitalism. Its about employment law. Unlike in communism you shall freely respond on any job öffers and nobody can deny it. There are clear rules how agreement between employee and employer shall look like.
But I dont find it any good. It makes everyone to care about him or his family only. Citizens participation is decreasing.
Uhm this was problem of communism. Public sphere became hostile, people felt safe only in family. Even between friends they had fear to express themselves. It led to Hobess society, stealing, distrust and pretence became norm. The civic society and participation grows after 1989.
i talk about capitalism as system what is here now, what evolved from changes after 1989 .. whatever it can be called .. and about its effect to our society.
probably life on debt is not the most effective seeing all economics crisis and national economies bancrupting
you cannot really afford to provide uneffective working places in current conditions when everything is focused on profit. Which means that without support of state there will be always quite high unemployment rate.
Yeah, strict and clear rules f.e. in public administration in situation when we are the only country in EU which has no Act on service of public (in force) , which means that public administration is under control of politic parties.
probably life on debt is not the most effective seeing all economics crisis and national economies bancrupting
you cannot really afford to provide uneffective working places in current conditions when everything is focused on profit. Which means that without support of state there will be always quite high unemployment rate.
Yeah, strict and clear rules f.e. in public administration in situation when we are the only country in EU which has no Act on service of public (in force) , which means that public administration is under control of politic parties.
I agree, I just beg to differ. Capitalism has its flaws but it definately cant be responsible for things like lack of social capital or law system how you imply. For grow of inadequality, lack of market stability or uneployment it shall be responsible, thats why there are laws which limit consequences and it shall be questionable if they are too strict or benevolent.
Hi Red :-D.
I agree with you.
Capitalism is really the best for economy (and also current problems in EU are here just because capitalism is mixed with "communism" :-) ). But for world/nature and for human beings is capitalism quite ugly and too hard. Our nature is devastated because of higher profit, people can not rest, everybody are in big slavery and 5% of all people are rich without working. But this system works because it has same principles like "human nature/essence". Human being are animals, always fighting for own purposes and ideas about human beings like something good, honesty and nice are just nice theory.
(I like that theory, and I would be happy if people are not so animal, I like that what is BZ saying, but I know that it is just dream)
I agree with you.
Capitalism is really the best for economy (and also current problems in EU are here just because capitalism is mixed with "communism" :-) ). But for world/nature and for human beings is capitalism quite ugly and too hard. Our nature is devastated because of higher profit, people can not rest, everybody are in big slavery and 5% of all people are rich without working. But this system works because it has same principles like "human nature/essence". Human being are animals, always fighting for own purposes and ideas about human beings like something good, honesty and nice are just nice theory.
(I like that theory, and I would be happy if people are not so animal, I like that what is BZ saying, but I know that it is just dream)
Oh man, you see capitalism in negative way.
Capitalism rewards creativity, hard-work, self-responsibility. It encourages cooperation, because it needs coworkers, investors and clients. That way it also get countries together. You shall get what you want by voluntary exchange of goods and services. In capitalism you shall be good, honest and nice as you shall be good, honest and nice in any competitive game.
Capitalism rewards creativity, hard-work, self-responsibility. It encourages cooperation, because it needs coworkers, investors and clients. That way it also get countries together. You shall get what you want by voluntary exchange of goods and services. In capitalism you shall be good, honest and nice as you shall be good, honest and nice in any competitive game.
Capitalism has its flaws but it definately cant be responsible for things like lack of social capital or law system how you imply
the same we can say for any economic system..
You must decide to take the same consequences for evey type of economic system!
Capitalism is this we live or is a theory never realized?
The same for democracy or other political systems..
Do we have to look on pratical realization or on theory?
Let's start talk about with same lokk on every direction and we'll find very difficult to prefer something to something else.
WHY?
Because the economy and politic systems can say something but not enough to explain a society.
Because we must decide before what is likely to realize then how good is a system.
there are a lot of thing to discuss first to give an evalutation!
the same we can say for any economic system..
You must decide to take the same consequences for evey type of economic system!
Capitalism is this we live or is a theory never realized?
The same for democracy or other political systems..
Do we have to look on pratical realization or on theory?
Let's start talk about with same lokk on every direction and we'll find very difficult to prefer something to something else.
WHY?
Because the economy and politic systems can say something but not enough to explain a society.
Because we must decide before what is likely to realize then how good is a system.
there are a lot of thing to discuss first to give an evalutation!
This is same dream like have efective and free communism system :). It is easy and common buy politics, laws on demand, judge, policeman in capitalism. Now you will say that this has nothing to do with capitalism but you will be wrong :). All is just about money, moral values are just for TV fairytales, not for our loved capitalism.
In communism were moral values forced but a lot of people like it and there was not so huge corruption, crime and unhappiness.
Anyway, I hate everything was is forced and I like individualism and competiton, so I like capitalism too.
the same we can say for any economic system..
You must decide to take the same consequences for evey type of economic system!
Sure, thats my point. Economical system itself hasnt any consequences in political participation, social capital and cant be responsible for bad laws.
(editado)
You must decide to take the same consequences for evey type of economic system!
Sure, thats my point. Economical system itself hasnt any consequences in political participation, social capital and cant be responsible for bad laws.
(editado)
It is easy and common buy politics, laws on demand, judge, policeman in capitalism. Now you will say that this has nothing to do with capitalism but you will be wrong :)
Would I? Isnt biggest corruption actually in countries without free market? Isnt it easier corrupt poor than prosperous? Only difference is that in earlier systems it was completely normal and unquestionable. People were automatically bringing gifts to administration in socialism or feudalism because they expected better treatment, not because good social relations or moral values.
Would I? Isnt biggest corruption actually in countries without free market? Isnt it easier corrupt poor than prosperous? Only difference is that in earlier systems it was completely normal and unquestionable. People were automatically bringing gifts to administration in socialism or feudalism because they expected better treatment, not because good social relations or moral values.